MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

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Forestress
Viestit: 158
Liittynyt: La 17.09.2011 12:20

Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja Forestress » Ke 10.08.2016 0:15

Sea Sand Sun Mega lupasi merta, hiekkaa ja aurinkoa ja sitä kaikkea se totisesti tarjosi.
:D :D :D

Ohjelmatarjontaa oli niin paljon, että ihan hirvitti, kun "tyytyi" vain suorittelemaan hyvin järjestettyjä ja helteeseen sopivan leppoisia labeja, kruisailemaan (ei siinä ehtinyt kahavittelemaan) lähikätköillä ja juttelemaan iloisten oranssinauharintaisten ihmisten kanssa. (Tuo se kaularemmi oli hyvä oivallus. Muuten ei olisi kanssahullua välttämättä tunnistanutkaan). Aika kului kuin siivillä. Ruokaa ja herkkuja kuten hirmu isoja pehmiksiä löytyi ihan läheltä. Hyvissä ajoin varattu mökkimajoitus oli hyvä. Paikoitusongelmia ei tainnut olla kellään, kun kertaakaan en nähnyt autoja jonossa alueelle. Jonoja ei ollut myöskään kolmiulotteisille lokikirjoille, jotka vetivät hyvin.

Jos nyt jotain negatiivista pitäisi kaivamalla kaivaa, niin onhan se nyt väärin, että juuri kun olet perjantaina pukenut remppakamppeet päälle ja vetänyt hanskat käteen osallistuksesi rakennustalkoisiin, sinulle tarjottiin vain lokikirjaa ja bingonpeluuta sen sijaan. No, täytyy myöntää, että punapaitaiset olivatkin paljon pätevämmän näköisiä työssään. ;-) Onneksi Megassa sai sentään megailla ja CITOssa siivoilla.

Lisäksi jäi harmittamaan, että tarjolla olisi ollut niin paljon muutakin mukavaa tekemistä. Megan olisi pitänyt ajoittua useammalle päivälle näin hienossa lokaatiossa, jossa yhden päivän saisi kulumaan vain etsimällä aarteita tai jahtaamalla jotain kärpästä. Emme oikein päässeet ison tapahtuman tunnelmaan vasta kuin la illalla, koska emme ehtineet mukaan camonrakennukseen, painamiseen tai kuuluisuuksien haastatteluihin. Camus callassa oli paljon osallistujia, jotka eivät olleet saaneet tai vastanottaneet ohjeistuksia, joten improlla mentiin. Joku olisi voinut koeponnistaa, onko inhimillisesti mahdollista ryysiä kätkömetsissä viikko, harppoa pari päivää hiekassa, sihistä tai viheltää ensin viisi minuuttia ja huutaa sen jälkeen sama aika sanaa "kätkö", "jästi" yms. Huutavan aika on pitkä, ja minuutin päästä ei kurkusta tule enää ääntä. Vaikka kokemus oli ikimuistoinen, olisin ehkä mieluummin istunut tuon ajan iltanuotiolla tutustumassa uusiin oranssinauhallisiin. Mutta auringonlasku oli upea! ;-)

Kiitos kaikille upeasta Mega-viikonlopusta pe-su!
--- Forestress - Forest is my Fortress ---

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IhmisAnkka
Viestit: 372
Liittynyt: Ti 24.09.2013 16:45
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja IhmisAnkka » Ke 10.08.2016 8:57

Forestress kirjoitti:Sea Sand Sun Mega lupasi merta, hiekkaa ja aurinkoa ja sitä kaikkea se totisesti tarjosi.
:D :D :D

Ohjelmatarjontaa oli niin paljon, että ihan hirvitti, kun "tyytyi" vain suorittelemaan hyvin järjestettyjä ja helteeseen sopivan leppoisia labeja, kruisailemaan (ei siinä ehtinyt kahavittelemaan) lähikätköillä ja juttelemaan iloisten oranssinauharintaisten ihmisten kanssa. (Tuo se kaularemmi oli hyvä oivallus. Muuten ei olisi kanssahullua välttämättä tunnistanutkaan). Aika kului kuin siivillä. Ruokaa ja herkkuja kuten hirmu isoja pehmiksiä löytyi ihan läheltä.
En tiedä, kuinka sääntöjen mukaista kaupallisuus Megassa on, mutta yhteistyökumppaninin Hesburgerin tarjousta tuli käytettyä pariinkin otteeseen. Ihme ja kumma, kerkisin uimaankin asti, koskapa Suomen Ladulla on kesäuintihaaste, niin oli pakko kastautua myös meressä ja se oli tietysti oikein hyvä idea. Hyvä, että sää suosi, kun edellisinä päivinä oli tullut vettä taivaan täydeltä.

Forestress kirjoitti: Jonoja ei ollut myöskään kolmiulotteisille lokikirjoille, jotka vetivät hyvin.
Oikein hyvä oivallus. Historiallisessa Hämeessä aika meni jonottamiseen logikirjalle ja sitten jonotettiin lab-kätköille.
Forestress kirjoitti: Jos nyt jotain negatiivista pitäisi kaivamalla kaivaa, niin onhan se nyt väärin, että juuri kun olet perjantaina pukenut remppakamppeet päälle ja vetänyt hanskat käteen osallistuksesi rakennustalkoisiin, sinulle tarjottiin vain lokikirjaa ja bingonpeluuta sen sijaan.
Ne olivatkin "talakoot" eikä talkoot.
Forestress kirjoitti: Megan olisi pitänyt ajoittua useammalle päivälle näin hienossa lokaatiossa
Olen samaa mieltä!

Kun nyt otettiin tämä mökkimajoitus esille, niin mökkimajoituksen hinta oli enemmän kuin mitä nettisivulla sanottiin ja Inclusus lupasi ottaa yhteyttä kuluttaja-asiamieheen.
Kuva

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MikaS
Viestit: 296
Liittynyt: Pe 05.12.2008 0:25
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja MikaS » Ke 10.08.2016 15:20

Ihan sama hinta, mitä olin puolisen vuotta sitten maksanut. Kuitilla kämppään.

MikaS

kyrasantae
Viestit: 19
Liittynyt: Ma 02.02.2015 20:55
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja kyrasantae » Ke 10.08.2016 16:07

I'm still recovering from the road trip there and back, and I haven't written up any of my logs yet, but some thoughts that came to mind:

I liked the choice of location - even though it may not be the most convenient to get to without a vehicle, but once you were there, there were many different things to do and places to visit, and bicycles were available to be rented if you wanted to go a bit farther. I didn't participate in any of the extra excursions, but it seemed like they were all going well and things were being run on time.

I felt that there could have been more guidance in English for international visitors. I know that the majority of people attending were Finns, though. When organizing a large event, it's easy to forget that there will be people who don't speak your language, and it's easy to forget that visitors also need to be able to read the signs, etc. (I saw some people queuing in the wrong lane to get into the campground because the handmade signs directing traffic were in Finnish (although that's a very minor issue).) If we want to continue attracting more visitors from abroad to these events, it's important to try to give everybody equal opportunity to enjoy all of the activities, regardless of their knowledge of Finnish. Some ideas:

I'm aware that the bingo sheet was available in English but for example the programme booklet could be bilingual so that people don't need to specially ask for one in English (was there an English programme booklet? I can read Finnish so I didn't ask about it), and you don't need to worry about running out of copies of either language. I guess it might end up being more expensive to print, though.

For the lab caches, maybe a translation of the Finnish passwords (and lab cache names) into English can be included somehow? For example, with the names of the knots and sea markers, translations could be written underneath in brackets. For visitors who don't know Finnish, they were just random letters with no context. It could be then included in the instructions to enter only the Finnish word as the password or something like that.

It also would have been nice to have a translator during the interviews. I think foreign visitors might be interested to hear about the experiences of Finnish cachers and caching culture too, to see how it differs from that in their own country. (Ignore this if you did have a translator - I've only seen the video that has been posted, and I was just leaving the restaurant when the interviews started. I did not hear the introduction being presented in English at all.)

----

I don't want to come off sounding overly critical, but please contact me if there is any way I can help with language considerations at future events 8) . English is my mother tongue and I would be happy to write or check English translations to make sure that they are correct and understandable.

Jebe903
Viestit: 11
Liittynyt: Ti 23.09.2014 10:07
Paikkakunta: Kuusamo

Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja Jebe903 » Ke 10.08.2016 17:27

Totta tuo kritiikki kieliongelmista- so true that critic about langauge only in finnish. Maybe next time good idea to have volunteer people, also during the Mega, to help translating. Also the programme could be somewhere written in the the internetpages where anyone can print it already in advance- and easy to print in the Mega event more if needed. I was running the wherigo with a girl who said- I don´t understand what should I do! Good to remember make the caches also in english!
BUT overall my first Mega and we were enjoying it fullhearthily! Kiitos järjestäjille!!!

kyrasantae
Viestit: 19
Liittynyt: Ma 02.02.2015 20:55
Paikkakunta: Espoo

Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja kyrasantae » Ke 10.08.2016 19:01

Jere07 kirjoitti:Also the programme could be somewhere written in the the internetpages where anyone can print it already in advance- and easy to print in the Mega event more if needed.
Actually yeah, the schedule grid was available in English on the website. I think the only important pages in the programme booklet that didn't have a translation was that and the children's events programme. But it might have been disappointing to see "panel discussion" on the programme and go there, only to not understand anything.

One thing I liked about the Estonia Mega programme booklet was that there was a short welcome message from the organizers, and a page or two of basic information and interesting facts about the area (Saue Parish), so that you could learn a little bit of geography too.

I don't think we should expect everyone all the time to make English texts for their caches, but if you are making one around the Mega area and planning to have it published around that time, I think it would be much appreciated. (Visitors might not have reliable internet access to run Google Translate, and besides, it doesn't work very well for Finnish.)

Kattila1
Viestit: 18
Liittynyt: Su 03.05.2015 11:20

Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja Kattila1 » Pe 12.08.2016 21:18

Mitäs tohon meillä sanomista...? What we can say about that? Nothing.

Sorry, and we hope you can enjoy any where, in our great country and plases where you go on your trip whith MEGA - Finland 2016? - Dont remember bad, i hope?

kyrasantae
Viestit: 19
Liittynyt: Ma 02.02.2015 20:55
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja kyrasantae » Pe 12.08.2016 22:02

I've lived (and geocached) in Finland for a few years now so I didn't have any problems, because I can read enough to get around. But just thinking from the point of view of people who have no experience with that.

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satumh
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja satumh » La 13.08.2016 0:44

Yes. We tried our best at the INFO to clarifying all the issues an stuff. But sure, I agree, all the INFO should have been also available in english as well. The most of the INFO *was * available in english at webpage but having it also available in printed version, that would not hurted anyone, I think, just the opposite. Maybe we have learned something thinking about next year regarding this issue. :)
Viimeksi muokannut satumh, La 13.08.2016 1:07. Yhteensä muokattu 1 kertaa.

Black_Island
Viestit: 294
Liittynyt: Ma 22.12.2008 18:18

Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja Black_Island » La 13.08.2016 0:53

kyrasantae kirjoitti:
It also would have been nice to have a translator during the interviews. I think foreign visitors might be interested to hear about the experiences of Finnish cachers and caching culture too, to see how it differs from that in their own country. (Ignore this if you did have a translator - I've only seen the video that has been posted, and I was just leaving the restaurant when the interviews started. I did not hear the introduction being presented in English at all.).
We thought of this. And then we decided that maybe no-one (non-Finnish speaking) is interested in what a Finnish geocacher has to say... So this was a decision not to translate the interview in English.

If there is an interest on this, English text added to the video is not a problem I think?

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satumh
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja satumh » La 13.08.2016 1:13

Last year, in Hämeenlinna, gandal491 did the translations during the interviews, didn't he? Late now, but should have asked him to help this year as well. He would have helped, I'm sure.

Edit. Actually he was asked to do the translating this year as well but he wasn't available for the job this time.
Viimeksi muokannut satumh, La 13.08.2016 20:50. Yhteensä muokattu 1 kertaa.

kyrasantae
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja kyrasantae » La 13.08.2016 10:31

Black_Island kirjoitti:
kyrasantae kirjoitti:
It also would have been nice to have a translator during the interviews. I think foreign visitors might be interested to hear about the experiences of Finnish cachers and caching culture too, to see how it differs from that in their own country.
We thought of this. And then we decided that maybe no-one (non-Finnish speaking) is interested in what a Finnish geocacher has to say... So this was a decision not to translate the interview in English.

If there is an interest on this, English text added to the video is not a problem I think?
It should be pretty easy to make subtitles on Youtube, yes. Then maybe it can be posted as an announcement so people who were there can know about it.

In Estonia, because they presented most things in both languages, I learned that there were Estonians who completed the NKT trail only on foot -- that kind of interesting fact is interesting to anyone regardless of which country they're from. I think for most people it's fun to learn about things are done differently in other places, how players think differently about the game, etc.

(You may now return to your normal Finnish discussion, if you want.)

geo-sampo
Viestit: 107
Liittynyt: Ke 19.03.2008 19:31

Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja geo-sampo » La 13.08.2016 17:12

maisymousee kirjoitti:
Delenna kirjoitti: Ainoastaan Signal-vuoroissa koin häikkää, sillä yksi mun vuoroista oli korvattu toisella henkilöllä (samoin Signalin avustaja). Tämä mitään mulle kertomatta/kysymättä. Onneksi huomasin ajoissa ja päätin sitten olla nostamatta meteliä ja kätköillä senkin ajan. Kuulin, että jonkun toisen vuorot oli siirretty peräkkäin, myös kysymättä/sanomatta. Lieneekö joku innokas signaloija sooloillut... Onneksi muut vuoroni saivat olla rauhassa ja pääsin toteuttamaan sisäistä sammakkoani yllin kyllin <3
Voi,ja höh :shock: Pahoitteluni, Delenna! Olikohan jollain kello edistänyt / jäljestänyt, vai mitä ihmettä on tapahtunut :?: :!: Sinä olit kyllä aivan loistava sammakko, ilo oli katsella tosiaan sen sisäisen sammakon vauhtiin pääsyä! Ja olihan sammakko ihana ja loistava ihan koko tapahtuman ajan; jotenkin liikuttavaa miten sen halattavaksi pääseminen oli niin kova juttu kaikille, niin pienille kuin isoillekin vastaantulijoille :)

Isot kiitokset siis kaikille teille vapaaehtoisille, jotka sammakkopuvun päällenne puitte viikonlopun aikana!
Valtavasti kiinnostaa tietää, kuka oli sammakon asussa heti, lauantai aamuna.. ☺ Kenen hellään kainaloon pääsin kuvaan..?
Kätkö päivässä pitää mielen apeana, -kaksi auttaa jo hiukan.

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IhmisAnkka
Viestit: 372
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja IhmisAnkka » La 13.08.2016 17:52

kyrasantae kirjoitti: In Estonia, because they presented most things in both languages, I learned that there were Estonians who completed the NKT trail only on foot -- that kind of interesting fact is interesting to anyone regardless of which country they're from. I think for most people it's fun to learn about things are done differently in other places, how players think differently about the game, etc.
I must've missed it, but I agree, it is interesting.

More to my level is the question: who was inside Signal. In Kalajoki there was Delenna inside and therefore it was probably good I did not tell Signal my wishes for the challenge caches and how I hate multis where you must do heavy calculations and other pressing matters.
Kuva

MickieWalker
Viestit: 16
Liittynyt: Ke 29.04.2015 8:08

Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja MickieWalker » Su 14.08.2016 11:18

satumh kirjoitti:Last year, in Hämeenlinna, gandal491 did the translations during the interviews, didn't he? Late now, but should have asked him to help this year as well. He would have helped, I'm sure.

Edit. Actually he was asked to do the translating this year as well but he wasn't available for the job this time.
Hmm... The reason for not translating the interviews was NOT that I and Black_Island would not speak English. :D :D We do.

Originally, we were asked to do the interviews. Language issue was not discussed. Then, a couple of weeks before Mega, when we (myself and Black_Island) wrote the interview questions and planned how the interviews should be done, we discussed about the language issue and decided NOT to translate the interviews in English. Why??

Well. We had 30 minutes to use for 3 interviews. This was perfect, because I think otherwise it would have been too long. People get bored if these things are not short and sharp. But if we wanted to translate the questions and the answers... Well, realistically, it would have meant 10 minutes for interviews and 20 minutes for translating. Makes very little sense to me, or then we should have interviewed just one person, to get anything out of it. But selecting just one interviewee would have been very difficult, because we had so many great candidates. Also, I think if more than half of the time goes to translating, it is VERY boring to the audience. Audience who is likely to be 99 % Finnish speaking...?

On the other hand, we thought: would there even be many foreigners listening to the interviews??? We did not think so. First of all, very small percentage of those who visit Mega, are from other countries. Some, of course. But how many of them came to listen to the interviews? None? A couple? I don't know. It is probably not very interesting to the foreigners to listen to the interviews of geocachers they have never (probably) even heard of.

So, based on this kind of thinking, we thought that it makes no sense to translate the interviews and make them boring for the majority of the audience. I am sorry if this was a wrong decision. (I still feel it was not, anyway).

MickieWalker

kyrasantae
Viestit: 19
Liittynyt: Ma 02.02.2015 20:55
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja kyrasantae » Su 14.08.2016 11:56

Okay, given the time constraint, that's understandable. A solution in that case would be to mark the interviews as being "(in Finnish)" on the English schedule grid so people know that there is no point going there if they won't understand. I have talked to at least one visitor from Spain who was a bit confused, and a notation like this is fairly common at academic conferences where sessions may be in one language or another or both. (I still disagree that foreigners aren't interested, though.)

Nonetheless, the bit about the lab cache passwords could still be improved.

finder313
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja finder313 » Su 14.08.2016 17:48

Onkos Megan muistokätkö jo julkaistu johon sai FBA:n lokata hiekkasärkkien citossa?

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IhmisAnkka
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja IhmisAnkka » Su 14.08.2016 17:59

finder313 kirjoitti:Onkos Megan muistokätkö jo julkaistu johon sai FBA:n lokata hiekkasärkkien citossa?
Oon odottanut kuin kuuta nousevaa, mutta en ole nähnyt.
Kuva

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IhmisAnkka
Viestit: 372
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja IhmisAnkka » Su 14.08.2016 18:05

MickieWalker kirjoitti: Well. We had 30 minutes to use for 3 interviews. This was perfect, because I think otherwise it would have been too long. People get bored if these things are not short and sharp. But if we wanted to translate the questions and the answers... Well, realistically, it would have meant 10 minutes for interviews and 20 minutes for translating. Makes very little sense to me, or then we should have interviewed just one person, to get anything out of it. But selecting just one interviewee would have been very difficult, because we had so many great candidates. Also, I think if more than half of the time goes to translating, it is VERY boring to the audience. Audience who is likely to be 99 % Finnish speaking...?
I agree with MickieWalker. In Hauho last year it was translated and it was very boring and long-winding. I have been to several meetings and there is a special section for foreign audiences with a translator or two. Better enough, when the vids are uploaded into the 6123-blog, they could be translated there. Better late than never, right.
And in what comes to Estonia Mega, I just remember the long time laying on the stage in hot weather waiting for something to happen, mostly waiting for the meal, and watching people kiiking. It was a surprise to me to find out that there was any spoken program at all, sure I missed it all.
Kuva

kyrasantae
Viestit: 19
Liittynyt: Ma 02.02.2015 20:55
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Re: MEGA 2016 - Sea Sand Sun Kalajoki 2016

Viesti Kirjoittaja kyrasantae » Su 14.08.2016 19:26

IhmisAnkka kirjoitti:And in what comes to Estonia Mega, I just remember the long time laying on the stage in hot weather waiting for something to happen, mostly waiting for the meal, and watching people kiiking. It was a surprise to me to find out that there was any spoken program at all, sure I missed it all.
It was after the lottery draws, when they were giving out the prizes for the poker run and best Estonian geocaches of the year, that they mentioned it. They also had the two comedians doing some short stand-up sets. (I probably sat around there a lot longer than you did, I could barely walk because my feet were hurt fairly badly.)

Having a special session for foreigners was a suggestion I thought of mentioning, but labour and time constraints can make that challenging too.

Anyway, moving on from the interviews question, what about the other things like ideas about the programme book and lab caches?

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